December 26, 2010

God Came Down (Sola Sisters)

We had an inspiring message today, on Simeon's reception of the newborn Jesus at the temple by our high school Sunday School teacher (pastor was out of town).

Then I was treated to Sola Sisters' excellent post God Came Down.

I don't know why I hadn't thought of things quite the way her opening paragraph explains it:


God Came Down

Have you ever stopped to ponder why it is that, when the world attempts to portray what it would look like for the supernatural world to intersect with the natural world, the things they come up with are most often frightening and perverted in some way? Many examples of this come to mind: werewolves, vampires, Frankenstein, zombies, aliens, mummies, and so on. The human mind seems predisposed to think of the supernatural in a way that is scary, frightening, and most often a horrific perversion of what is normal and natural. From a Christian perspective, though, doesn't it make sense that the natural, unregenerated mind - in its sin-darkened state - can only conjure up a darker, more frightening version of what it "knows" (humans and human-ess) when attempting to make sense of the world? After all, the Bible tells us that man is darkened in his understanding, his wisdom is foolishness.

The truth is that, without benefit of the special revelation of God's Word, the Bible, the human view of that which is supernatural seems to default to the freakish and the frightening.

But what does it really look like for God to enter into time and space, and intersect with the natural world by taking on flesh and dwelling among us?

read more at Sola Sisters.

December 19, 2010

Apprising goes after Dan Kimball's orthodoxy

Boy that Kimball is a slippery fish isn't he!

(except in private, apparently)

By writing this piece, one would think there must be some disagreements between Ken and Chris by this time over this particular issue, n'est-ce pas?

One of those involved with the EC, right from very early on, would be Dan Kimball, author of the book The Emerging Church. You may recall that I wrote a piece concerning Kimball last February called Curious Associations Ed Stetzer, Dan Kimball, And Tim Keller MissionSHIFT where I pointed you to this rather odd association of alleged Reformed men with Kimball. I also told you that I have spoken to him numerous times over a period of five years via email and by phone.

However, I ceased doing so because each time Kimball had asked me to keep any of the details off the record, which really doesn’t help at all; for you see, when one is a teacher in the public arena like Dan Kimball, via church conferences and books etc., then their beliefs and teachings are there for all to see. The problem which then arises is when one later says privately that they might believe other than their public record would indicate, then they themselves are introducing confusion. Recently Dan Kimball gave an interview, as you can see in Dan Kimball On The Record; some of which he chose to use to take some swipes at those of us in this line of ministry that he referred to as “watchdog discernment ministry.”

read more at:



and Mike Ratliff has also weighed in on Dan Kimball's call to 'discern the discerners.'

November 30, 2010

Chris Rosebrough's heresy chart and the false separation of Deeds and Creeds

(note as of 2-24-2015: I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  On 9-2013 there was an update on the Ingrid/ChrisR situation - please go here:  Ingrid and Chris had reconciled.  This was a good thing.  We were all friends again.)

 Further update here:
I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  Too much hypocrisy, too many double standards, too many false accusations. I apologize for all the confusion.  I pray it won't happen again.)

Oh, if only it were so simple as to be able to place people in one of four categories.

Only problem is, God puts people in one of two categories. Believer or Unbeliever. Forgiven or Unforgiven.

I also found this article from Modern Reformation By Michael Horton which speaks of the same issue:

Creeds and Deeds
"Not even in Corinth, where strife, immorality, greed, and the profaning of the Lord's Supper threatened the peace and purity of the church, did Paul seem to think that the problem was deeds rather than creeds. He always thought that when believers were "acting up," the first recourse was to preach the gospel again, to recall believers to their one Lord, one faith, one baptism, and one Spirit. At the same time, even where the focus of the problem was doctrinal (as in Galatians), he did not fail to point up the spiritual and ethical issues involved. And even where the focus of the problem was spiritual and ethical, he did not fail to preach the doctrine. Paul would have considered it inconceivable that a church might have its doctrine right but be uninterested in missions, evangelism, prayer, and works of service and charity to those in need-or, conversely, that a church might be faithful in life apart from sound doctrine. Orthodoxy and orthopraxy were inseparable and mutually dependent elements of Paul's message."
(all emphases mine)

November 28, 2010

A Lutheran Review of the Purpose Driven life (by Steven R J Parks)

I have been looking for this article for a while now, and happened across Daniel Neades' blog post from September 28, 2010 which quotes large portions of the article. I have been unable to locate the direct link but only the google cached copy. Everything I could find linking to critiques of the Purpose Driven Life on theoriginal site has been removed. This does not sound good to me.

You can see that they had some discussion over the article originally but all these other links on this page and this page have been taken down.

There is a note on their front page now that says "Once again, we have had to redo our website because of the frequent and serious attacks our site received. We have moved to a new host company with, hopefully, better protection against attacks."

Hmm do you think Rick Warren's supporters were flooding them with hate mail? I wouldn't be surprised. But maybe we'll never know.

Anyway, here is the original article. I had to copy and paste it bit by bit because the formatting wasn't agreeing with my blogging software. This allowed me to keep the links, which link back to the original blog in case they ever put it back up.

This article is especially helpful in understanding the problem, for those who actually still think Rick Warren "keeps things simple and practical."


November 25, 2010

Thinking About Orthodoxy (Better Than Sacrifice)

(aside: for an update on the Ingrid/ChrisR/Chris/Me situation please go here:

Daniel Neades has written a LONG but brilliant piece analyzing the Rosebrough/Kimball situation.
In this article Daniel makes the case that Dan Kimball is not really orthodox, as both Chris and Dan are claiming.
Also, this morning Jason articulated something we have been saying for most of this two weeks, but articulated more specifically than either of us has so far:

Given that Guilt By Association is a form of Ad Hominem -AND THAT ad hominems are NOT always fallacious depending on how they are used.

November 23, 2010

Ingrid Schlueter Clarifies a Statement That Was Misunderstood

(note as of 2-24-2015: I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  On 9-2013 there was an update on the Ingrid/ChrisR situation - please go here:  Ingrid and Chris had reconciled.  This was a good thing.  We were all friends again.)

 Further update here:
I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  Too much hypocrisy, too many double standards, too many false accusations. I apologize for all the confusion.  I pray it won't happen again.)

Ingrid issued a clarification at the very beginning of the Crosstalk show today regarding a statement she made on her "Beware the Bridgers" program last week:
"Last Tuesday, I hosted a program with Deborah Dombrowski of Lighthouse Trails Publishing on the subject of 'Bridge People' and how these pastors and leaders who are not separating biblically from false teachers are causing division and spiritual harm as they BRIDGE the gap between Christianity and the false spirituality that we're seeing emerge all over the place today. The subject was not heretics themselves, that publishing books and speaking at conferences, but rather those who serve as 'bridge people' to this new emergent spirituality by their refusal to be clear, and their refusal to warn about the others and their affiliation with those who are teaching false doctrine.

More on BSF's downgrade (from DoNotBeSurprised)

Do Not Be Surprised has quite a few posts on BSF that I thought I would share. Thank you Erin for sending that along.

Since the great delusion is flooding into every Christian group, program, and church, it is no surprise to find it in BSF also. Do Not Be Surprised, I guess!

Emergents/Emergings T Jones, A Jones, Pagitt, Kimball, Burke, McLaren, Seay are ALL Orthodox!

They even said so!

By Tony Jones, Doug Pagitt, Spencer Burke, Brian McLaren, Dan Kimball, Andrew Jones, Chris Seay

We offer this in response to recent criticisms, with the hope that it will cause some to better understand us and others to find hope in a document that they can sign on to.

Emergent Village's response to critics:

PDF version here

"Sixth, we would like to clarify, contrary to statements and inferences made by some, that yes, we truly believe there is such a thing as truth and truth matters – if we did not believe this, we would have no good reason to write or speak; no, we are not moral or epistemological relativists any more than anyone or any community is who takes hermeneutical positions – we believe that radical relativism is absurd and dangerous, as is arrogant absolutism; yes, we affirm the historic Trinitarian Christian faith and the ancient creeds, and seek to learn from all of church history – and we honor the church’s great teachers and leaders from East and West, North and South; yes, we believe that Jesus is the crucified and risen Savior of the cosmos and no one comes to the Father except through Jesus; no, we do not pit reason against experience but seek to use all our God-given faculties to love and serve God and our neighbors; no, we do not endorse false dichotomies – and we regret any false dichotomies unintentionally made by or about us (even in this paragraph!); and yes, we affirm that we love, have confidence in, seek to obey, and strive accurately to teach the sacred Scriptures, because our greatest desire is to be followers and servants of the Word of God, Jesus Christ. We regret that we have either been unclear or misinterpreted in these and other areas."

Chris better apologize for calling them heretics. And he better be lining them up to be on his show. And apologize to Rick Warren for calling him a pelagian. I mean, if he wants people to take his proposed ethical code seriously!

Chris Rosebrough Reverts to Pietism

(aside: for an update on the Ingrid/ChrisR situation please go here:  Ingrid and Chris had reconciled.  This was a good thing.  We were all friends again.)

(2-25-2015 Further update here:
I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  Too much hypocrisy, too many double standards, too many false accusations.)

Chris's New Law

Chris has turned a corner. And now he's in the seedy part of town, deciding he can fix all the problems of people not seeing eye to eye in the ODM "industry."

Chris Rosebrough
I've begun working on a Discernment Ethics Standard. It's painfully clear to me that something like this is LONG overdue.
5 hours ago via TweetDeck · Like · Comment

Chris Rosebrough ​@Tom - most industries have standards. Since Discernment is becoming more like a mini industry and some Discernment Shops have quality products while others, not so much. It's time to put some industry standards in place to ratchet up the quality and weed out the poor quality shops.
4 hours ago · Like · 1 person

Chris Rosebrough ​@Marlene - I've been in conversations with others in the Discernment Camp and there are a few of us who think that something like this is long overdue and if it had been in place prior to this incident it wouldn't have gone down the way it did.
4 hours ago · Like · 1 person

Name these "others" Chris. I wonder if CARM could be one after the email discussion My husband and I just had with Kendell Cook, wherein I was told that everyone he's spoken to (again unnamed) thinks I have a screw loose ("dislodged a screw" is the exact phrase) and that I ought to pipe down to save what little face I have left to save. And "Why isn't your husband dealing with this publicly?" 

(Um... he has been. Jason did write back to him immediately on all of those, and all I can say is young Kendell brought a knife to a gunfight there, even if it was just a spelling bee.  Response from Master Kendell?  *crickets*  *crickets*)

So, speaking of ethics violations... I guess we can insult people in private as long as we are nice and loving on our blogs!

November 22, 2010

A couple of additional Kimball pdf's

(note as of 2-24-2015: I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  On 9-2013 there was an update on the Ingrid/ChrisR situation - please go here:  Ingrid and Chris had reconciled.  This was a good thing.  We were all friends again.)

 Further update here:
I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  Too much hypocrisy, too many double standards, too many false accusations. I apologize for all the confusion.  I pray it won't happen again.)

So that people can get a fuller picture of what was being discussed on fb...

Chris defines guilt by association and has fun knocking down strawmen (remember that after this he played the Monty Python witch hunt thing to explain what he thought of our supposed "guilt by association" tactic)

I will also add this to my initial post Chris Rosebrough needs an intervention.

Chris's response to me so far has been basically to reiterate all he's said, and then ask me essentially "what are the charges you have against me."

I guess he'll just keep asking until he gets the answer he wants. Maybe I should just tell him oh, no charges, everything's fine. Right as rain. Have a nice day!

BSF Bible Study Fellowship going contemplative/emergent?

I have never been able to attend a BSF yet but I know lots of people do. Someone asked me about the new Isaiah curriculum and what I thought, but I didn't have any information or experience so I started looking. In the process I found this blog post so I thought I would pass the information along:


Ms. Rowan stood on stage and told us a story. A group of people from a Kansas City church had surrounded her to give her a blessing. They all laid hands on her and prayed in tongues over her.
On the last day of our leaders meeting for the year, my fears were realized. We receive a magazine with recommended books to read during the break. On the list was a book by Dallas Willard, a known contemplative/emergent. Also a verse was given from the apostate translation of the Bible, “The Message.”

read more at DiscernIt

November 21, 2010

More on the dearth of conviction in the ECM (Dan Kimball/TeamPyro)

I was pointed to this 3 year old article about Dan Kimball and Mark Driscoll and others in the Emerging/Emergent church.

More on the dearth of conviction in the ECM
Now, if Dan holds true to the interview Chris did with him, he'd say something like: "that was so three years ago! I've changed!" and then halfway through the interview he'll say "I'm teaching exactly what I have taught for 20 years."

If so, I haven't seen evidence of it in anything he's written on his blog. He still thinks he can consort with and recommend heretics and not confront their errors, and expect us all to cheer because he's a nice guy and recommends we all be nice. Well, Dan, we're trying, believe it or not. So stop nagging.

I guess Phil Johnson is guilty of violating the 8th commandment according to Chris Rosebrough now.

(note as of 2-24-2015: I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  On 9-2013 there was an update on the Ingrid/ChrisR situation - please go here:  Ingrid and Chris had reconciled.  This was a good thing.  We were all friends again.)

 Further update here:
I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  Too much hypocrisy, too many double standards, too many false accusations. I apologize for all the confusion.  I pray it won't happen again.)

Is Dan Kimball Really Holding Fast The Good Confession?

July 3, 2005 – Holding Fast the Good Confession
Topical – Pastor Bob DeWaay

(Yes, I know Bob has been demoted, but his teaching has been very good, and since then, he has been submitting to correction, which as he says here in this sermon is a mark of a preacher/teacher who is of the spirit of truth.)

Bob makes a case about not being straightforward about the truth of the gospel. Evasion is denial.

In Galatians according to Paul's report: "The problem wasn't Peter's doctrine it was his practice."

I think this applies to Dan Kimball, and this is why many are suspicious of him and why it is completely unreasonable of Chris to ask us to do 'research' and demand proof that Dan has taught heresy. Based on that unreasonable request, he has accused many of lying about a brother in Christ. But silence or a lack of evidence = denial so actually, the burden of proof is on Dan or Chris. Just today I found an article from 2005 where Dan is quoting Henri Nouwen favorably about 'forgiving the church' if it hurts us. What does the apostate mystic Nouwen know about the real church? Maybe what he really should have called this article was "Learning how to Ignore the Church's Valid Correction."

Sure, on Chris's Monday interview with Dan, Dan made some rudimentary confessions that Christ died for his sins on the cross. But how is that any different from what Mormons or Roman Catholics believe? The Galatians and the Judaizers made this confession as well, but received a strong rebuke from Paul anyway for that one little iota they added.

I hope Chris will listen to this and see that we aren't all running around with 'loose screws' just because we don't just take his word as gospel truth.

Partial Transcript:
"What we're being called to is a forthright public confession of the person and work of Jesus Christ that is so profound that our lives will never be the same again because we have confessed this, and that we are willing to live out the implications of that confession by God's grace.

...We may fail but God will bring us back...

I want to show you how this matter of confessing is a discernment tool. This will give you an objective tool so that you can know when you hear a teaching, whether it's from God or not. This is absolutely objective. And you don't have to have some subjective buzzer that goes off when you hear something wrong like one guy claimed. It doesn't work that way. If that was true, there wouldn't be 25,000 people in this church down in Texas [Lakewood]. Their 'buzzer' isn't going off. IF they were to follow this (because that pastor was on Larry King Live and didn't confess), they would have known. You have an objective tool. Here's what it says.

"Beloved do not believe every spirit but tests the spirits to see whether it is from God." Why? "Because many false prophets have gone out into the world." Now here's something we just learned. The spirits are speaking through people. False prophets have gone out and they don't come out with a sign that says 'false.' They don't wear a certain kind of clothing to mark them out from the true. The only way you're going to know when you're hearing a false prophet is to use objective criteria for discernment. They are coming out with a message to preach that comes from a spiritual source they say is coming from the Holy Spirit. We don't have to just wonder. We don't have to look and see how many people were shouting and jumping how many were slain under the power, how many got all excited or how many gave an offering or how many say this is a wonderful man of God. All of that is distracting. It doesn't help.

We need to use the tool God gave us to objectively determine where the teaching came from. Let's read about it in verses 2 and 3. "By this you know the Spirit of God. Every Spirit that confesses!" Here's our word again that we're studying. Homologia "to say the same thing as." in the Greek. "Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God. and Every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. And this is the spirit of antichrist that you have heard is coming and is now already in the world. So there is an anointing, antichrist, anti christos, substitute anointing, so there are anointed ones out there who are claiming to speak for God, they claim to be great men of God, or women of God as the case may be and they claim to have the words of God, but we may be misled. We may be listening to something that's not from the Holy Spirit. So John wrote this so that we could know objectively and clearly who is speaking for God. And what he tells us is this. That those people who are anointed by the Holy Spirit as speaking from the Holy Spirit WILL CONFESS. Now this doesn't mean merely utter the words. You can put a gun to somebody's head and they can say "Jesus Christ came in the flesh, I'll admit it." The demons believe Jesus Christ came in the flesh. But they're not going to preach the gospel, because they're opposed to that. This confession has to do with everything I'm talking about today. The full orb of what a Christian confessor looks like. One who preaches the gospel of Jesus Christ, who without hypocrisy applies the implications of the gospel of Jesus Christ, and doesn't evade the gospel of Jesus Christ and who was willing to live accordingly even if it means coming under church discipline or correction like Peter did. Such a person will be glad to be corrected. A confessor confesses the person and work of Christ. Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is John's shorthand way of talking about the whole doctrine of the incarnation and everything that it has to do with.

"Coming in the flesh:" that implies pre-existence. Not just born the way anyone was born, he came as born of the virgin Mary. In the flesh he lived out his life. In the flesh he lived a sinless life. In the flesh he was nailed to the cross bodily. In the flesh, he literally shed real blood for sins and in the flesh he came out of the grave, bodily raised still bearing the marks of Calvary so that he could show Thomas, so that Thomas would believe in Jesus Christ. And that is the content and you can read every sermon in the book of Acts and we'll see what it looks like to confess Jesus Christ coming in the flesh. In boldness they proclaimed to all whether they were Jews gathered at Pentecost, God-fearers in the household of Cornelius, Jewish leaders listening to Stephen, Athenian philosophers on Mars Hill, jailers, the praetorian guard in Rome, whoever came in contact with the New Testament apostles heard the exact same message proclaimed bodly without equivocation, without fear, and wthout evasion: "Who is Jesus Christ, what did he do, and why do we need him? Repent and believe the gospel." That will be the hallmark the calling card of every true preacher who is from the Holy Spirit.

Now notice here it says "Every spirit that does not confess." Silence is enough to prove the person is not from God. They don't have to actually come out and deny because silence is a denial when confession is called for. You say nothing if you are called into a court of law to be a witness, and by the way the word witness "marturion," closely linked in the NT to the word homologia, because you want to make the good confession in front of many witnesses, that's what Timothy did. Now if you're called into court to bear witness to certain facts, you're asked to swear to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Right? You're not there to evade. And if you're hauled before the court and you were there and you saw what happened, and you just won't say anything. I suppose you could plead the fifth if you were the guilty party, but let's say you're just a bystander who saw what happened. You have to say explicitly what you saw. You can't just shut up or evade or say nothing. You'd be held in contempt
Not confessing is evading. Silence means that you're not from God. So if we are witnesses of the person and work of Jesus Christ, and we're asked to testify as to the reason for the hope that is within us and we give a muted evasive non-clear answer, it's not satisfactory. It wouldn't be satisfactory in a human court. Now how much more is this required of a preacher? How much more when we get behind a pulpit? Is God satisfied if we entertain, if we have witty aphorisms about wisdom in life, we're able to make you happy, we're able to tell you how to have springs on your buggy so you have a smoother ride through life... that's not confessing and it fails this test.

Let's look at verse 5 now. This is very very telling. I think this verse here explains the whole seeker movement. “They are from the world therefore they speak as from the world. And the world listens to them.” Brothers and sisters if we speak the world’s language they’ll like us! They won’t persecute us. They want to hear, what does the world want to hear right now? Well we live in a mystical world so we’ll give them a mystic Christianity. We live in a relativistic world, we’ll give them a relativistic Christianity. We live in a postmodern world, we’ll give them a postmodern Christianity. We live in a world where they gave up on knowing the truth so we won’t give them any truth we’ll just give them a spiritual experience. We’ll just light some candles or we’ll just set the mood. Or we live in a world where people want to solve life’s problems, they want to live a better life, they don’t want to find out about heaven and hell and blood atonement and doctrine and all that stuff, so we won’t give them doctrine. We’ll give them practical life application. Brothers and sisters, that is the message that the world will listen to! Yes they will, and they will be your friend, and they’ll give you money and they’ll give you endorsements and they’ll ask you to speak at their conventions and you can be a big popular man in this world. But what does it say. They are from the world, therefore they speak as from the world. How dare us as Christians speak as from the world when we really don’t believe the world’s message? We are not allowed that option. I am not allowed to speak so that you think somehow what I have is the world’s wisdom. It has to be God’s wisdom from the Bible.

Notice the rest of this verse: “We are from God, he who knows God listens to us. He who is not from God does not listen to us. “ We don’t have any neutral middle ground here. And so therefore we have the decision to make. A very clear decision. Who do we want to appeal to. What audience are we looking for. If we’re preaching the gospel forthrightly and clearly, we realize right up front that it guarantees a much smaller audience. Narrow is the gate and narrow is the path that leads to eternal life. Absolutely. It’s guaranteed you’ll have less of an audience. The world has a lot of people. Billions of them. And there is a wide path with multitudes on it and if we want them to listen to us, we’re getting ourselves in trouble because now we’ve got to change our message. This isn’t just a matter of how clever you can be or how winsome you can be or how compelling you can be, it’s a matter of the actual content of the message and that’s an either or. Either the gospel, confess clearly OR some mixture that the world won’t even notice is NOT the gospel OR (is) the gospel, they don’t care, it sounds good to them.

I’m making the claim that what we’re being sold in modern evangelicalism is an ungodly mixture that appeals to the world. And we need to start preaching what the people who know God will listen to.

And you might say well if we’re gonna do that then we’re not concerned about reaching the lost! And I would say ABSOLUTELY NOT. That is the biggest lie you could ever hear. If we are really concerned about reaching the lost, we will preach the gospel, the only means God uses to SAVE the lost. And um, you can have a huge audience of worldly people and most of them are going to get mad at you, but God will save SOME. And those are the ones he was going to save. And they will come. And they will listen to us.

And so we have to determine right here and now what is the message of the church, what are we going to invest our money in, what are we going to invest our time in, what are we passionate about, and what are we going to proclaim, and be willing right here and now to say Lord, if that means a small audience, only that little flock that knows God, so be it! Thank God, that’s who I want to be with.

Notice he says he who is not from God does not listen to us. They’ll either be converted or they’ll get mad and they’ll leave. When we go out on the streets we preach the message the gospel. They’re either converted or they eat their hamburger and go home. But they hear the gospel. “By this we know” - notice this is not difficult, that’s what just boggles my mind. Honestly I can’t understand what’s going on in the church world today. Because this discernment isn’t hard, but there’s such a lack of it. Look at how easy it is. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error. This is our objective discernment tool. It’s the best tool you’ll ever have...

This is your godly discernment tool and it will keep you out of trouble. Is this the gospel? Is it coming from the spirit of God, is it proclaimed forthrightly? Remember Peter at one point wasn’t straightforward about the truth of the gospel. Are we straightforward about the truth of the gospel, and is the message that we’re hearing designed to appeal to those who know God or is our message designed to appeal to those in the world? Ask those questions and you’ve got your discernment. And you know what the very very scary sobering answer is? Most of the evangelical church is in error right now because of massive apostasy. I couldn’t believe it if I didn’t see it happen.

Bob does finish the message with the glorious good news that we all fail in this matter in many ways, because of our fear of man. But he offers forgiveness through Christ's shed blood on the cross.

Now, compare that to this:

The Christian Bubble Part 2 from CrossPoint Church on Vimeo.

Dan Kimball - They Like Jesus But Not The Church

I pray Dan will confess his fear of man and stop looking to the world for guidance on how he should be publicly preaching and teaching.

November 19, 2010

Chris Rosebrough needs an intervention (UPDATED)

(note as of 2-24-2015: I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  On 9-2013 there was an update on the Ingrid/ChrisR situation - please go here:  Ingrid and Chris had reconciled.  This was a good thing.  We were all friends again.)

 Further update here:
I am no longer a Pirate Christian supporter.  Too much hypocrisy, too many double standards, too many false accusations. I apologize for all the confusion.  I pray it won't happen again.)

Yes, ladies, I don't hide our past fights.  You Brannon and Pinto groupies are the censors. I had tried to go through and find all the posts pertaining to that fight, and add an update, but I apparently missed one.  (Thank you for notifying me!)  So now they are all tittering over it on Brannon's wall and thinking there's something they can exploit here. Sorry to disappoint! Reconciliation is a wonderful thing. Maybe Brannon and Pinto ought to learn about it sometime. It can be had in Christ, when one confesses their sins to one another and repents and forgives the other, because Christ as forgiven us so much.

I remained silent except on my Facebook wall for most of this past week, since Chris Rosebrough apparently went off his rocker for the second time (the first being the August Ground Zero Mosque debacle when Keith Olbermann, Nancy Pelosi, Barak Obama, and Bill Press started to make sense to him). This week it seemed he was no longer listening to anyone, and his error was so grievous that I defriended him, so I wouldn't feel tempted to bother him anymore. I am just tired.

Jason and some of my more level-headed online friends have taken him to task, however, and they are much more diplomatic than I. I hoped they would be able to talk sense to him, but it seems he is getting worse and worse. I grieve for his declining spiritual health.

This is no longer about Dan Kimball, this is about Chris.

Here are some pdf's of discussions that happened last week. You can click on the time stamp on these pdf's and they should take you to the original posts.
  1. Chris and his Emergent Buddies
  2. Chris says Ken Silva Agrees with him
  3. Chris's summary of what he thinks of Dan Kimball
  4. Chris posts pictures of his day with Dan Kimball
  5. I post Dan's videos on the Christian Bubble, which Chris doesn't see a problem with
  6. Brian McLaren's autograph thread
The situation keeps deteriorating. On Monday Chris played Dan on his show:

On Saturday Ingrid posted this:

Ingrid played this on Tuesday (instead of Wednesday):

Part 2 will be next Wednesday (11-20), she says "Lord willing."


So that people can get a fuller picture of what was being discussed on fb...

Chris defines guilt by association and has fun knocking down strawmen (remember that after this he played the Monty Python witch hunt thing to explain what he thought of our supposed "guilt by association" tactic)


Also note that Ingrid has explained that her poor sentence construction conveyed some misinformation; she has apologized to Chris for that and will be issuing a clarification/retraction. What she said on her program was this came to her attention because "an online Christian apologist and podcaster decided to push forward, on his Facebook page initially, Dan Kimball. This particular apologist and podcaster makes a habit of traveling around to Emerging Church conferences and dialoguing with some of the leading emergent church teachers. And has in the past posted photos of himself, arms around some of these false teachers like Jay Bakker, Nadia Bolz-Weber, Tony Jones, the latest of which was Dan Kimball. He called Dan Kimball a brother in Christ, and a friend, as he called the others."

It's been explained to Chris that she meant that him calling them 'friend' to apply to Kimball as well as the others, but not the "brother in Christ." He has forgiven Ingrid (well that's big of him) for her poor sentence construction. However he did not chide either person there for calling her a liar.

There have been phone calls going back and forth as well, and he is only digging in his heels more. What is going on with him? Frankly I wouldn't trust him to converse privately without recording the conversation right about now.

On his podcast the day after the Dan Kimball interview, he played the Monty Python Witch Trial to illustrate what he thinks of those who disagree. Mock heresy if you wish, but it does not pay to mock your friends when they are trying to warn you out of their love for you (imperfect as they are). Niceness seems to be much more important to Chris and his followers these days. This is exactly what Piper started talking like before he succumbed to the Purpose Driven Pope.

Chris has mocked those of us who tried to warn him and Bob about going to see Rick Warren a few years back as well. They both kind of pooh-poohed us then, and Chris continues to laugh about that now, not even seeing how it has borne fruit. When people warn you, it is because they care, and they know you are capable of being deceived just like anyone else. The whole attitude of "Don't worry about me, I'll be fine" is a prideful one. I know I can be corrupted from past experience trying to carry on long 'relational' dialogues with unbelievers. I have found myself wandering and rationalizing a lot of things that I at one time never dreamed I would do.

He's been equating those who disagree with his assessment of Kimball as pharisees who accused Jesus of eating with sinners. So because we are skeptical because of a rather scanty and mostly seeker-sensitive oriented public record, we are somehow sinning and bearing false witness? Speaking of poor reasoning skills...he asks for proof that Dan is teaching heresy. All one has to do is point to Chris's assessment of Rick Warren as a Pelagian, because all the same supports he has there apply to what is publicly available of Dan. He should now be apologizing to Rick Warren. And frankly, the way things have been going, I wouldn't be surprised if he did.

If there is all this public record of Dan distancing himself from these heretical people he consorts with, where is it? And Kimball saying "Oh, I don't agree with some of those things anymore" doesn't count. Which things? Who from your former associations have you discovered are heretical? Because he doesn't seem to ever name them, I have a hard time swallowing his private confessions to Chris as orthodox. This is the same sort of evasion you get when you confront a purpose-driven pastor who says "Well, I don't agree with everything Rick Warren says..." but never gets any more specific. He just uses a ton of words to convince you he agrees with you, all while saying nothing at all.

There is a long list of us who are concerned. I removed Chris as friend last week, because I felt I would monopolize his wall again and I felt he was being so irrational that it would do no good to argue. Jason, my husband, and Daniel Neades have been writing to him non-stop for much of the last week, without making much headway.

There have been phone calls going back and forth among some of the ODM's which Chris has not responded well to; he only gets angry. What is going on with him?

To top it off, Connie Waters of Outlaw Preachers is laughing and inviting him over to Outlaw Preachers where he will be welcomed with open arms (Really? Why would they want good solid law and gospel over there?) and he is laughing right along with her! Should that not give any discerning Christian pause, if Connie is ok with hanging out with him and mocking his friends on his own Facebook page (with kudos from him)? A good rule of thumb Chris, when the wolves are grinning at you, it's not because they're offended by the truth. You're either becoming one of them, or they plan to eat you for dinner.

Another rule of thumb, when the heretics sense of humor and mockery of your Christian friends sounds more appealing to you than your imperfect friends (Yeah, sometimes we're not as "nice" as those sweet heretics), it might be time to stop drinking (the emergent ale) and have someone drive you home.

November 17, 2010

New Agers embrace Rick Warren as one of their own

This is very telling, a post I was sent from a friend from Rapture Ready forum:
New Agers Embrace "Guru" Rick Warren as One of Their Own
the New Agers consider Rick Warren an important guru. We know enough about that community that despite Richard Abanes' false protestations that Rick Warren is "anti-New Age," the New Agers would not feature him unless they were convinced on very good authority that he was "one of them

He is about the 40th name down, but as you scroll down, look at the other names he has the privilege of being co guru's with

Oh and his admitted pluralism and one world religion agenda out of his own mouth

the direct link to Rick's NUMII page is here

November 16, 2010

CrossTalk "Beware the Bridgers" (Dan Kimball) *(UPDATED)

Ingrid did her show on the Dan Kimball issue today.

I was thinking it was going to be Wednesday, but apparently she pushed it up a day, so I'm taking a listen now.

UPDATE: Ingrid stated in the show:

"an online Christian apologist and podcaster decided to push forward, on his Facebook page initially, Dan Kimball. This particular apologist and podcaster makes a habit of traveling around to Emerging Church conferences and dialoguing with some of the leading emergent church teachers. And has in the past posted photos of himself, arms around some of these false teachers like Jay Bakker, Nadia Bolz-Weber, Tony Jones, the latest of which was Dan Kimball. He called Dan Kimball a brother in Christ, and a friend, as he called the others."

It's been relayed also to Chris by some on facebook after he accused her of lying that she meant that him calling them 'friend' to apply to Kimball as well as the others, but not the "brother in Christ." (I could see for myself that it was poor sentence construction when I first heard it, and I know that she was even commenting previously on the very photo of Bakker, Weber, and Jones in question so she knew what had been said.) It is odd that Chris was unwilling to put the best construction on her words here and ask her about it before semi-publicly accusing her of lying.

He said he has forgiven Ingrid (well that's big of him) for... her poor sentence construction? However he did not chide either person there for calling her a liar as far as I saw.

I am beginning to wonder if there can ever be a resolution to this without a major epiphany on Chris's part. And this makes me very sad.

November 7, 2010

For the Christian: “I Will Never Leave You Nor Forsake You” (Sola Sisters)

Our friends over at Sola Sisters have some very comforting words for the believer:

Thank you for this wonderful reminder, ladies.

November 1, 2010

Fear of Controversy

Frank Rue has posted on the Fear of Controversy over at his blog. I just started skimming it but it looks excellent and ties in very nicely with James Sundquist's rebuke of Rick Warren, John Piper, et al which I posted earlier. Here is a tidbit:
In the examples of opposing error, left on record for our imitation, we perceive nothing of that frigid spirit of indifference which smiles on the corruptors of the word of God, and shuns to call heresy by its proper name. With what holy indignation do the Apostles denounce the subtle machinations of the enemies of the gospel! In vain shall we look among those faithful servants of the Lord for any thing to justify that trembling reserve which fears to say decidedly that truth is truth, or that error is error. In what style indeed should perversions of the truth of God be censured? Ought they to be treated as mere matters of opinion on which we may innocently and safely differ? Or ought they to be met in a tone of solemn, strong, and decided disapprobation?
(Excerpt from Exposition of the Epistle to the Romans: with remarks on the commentaries of Dr. MacKnight, Professor Moses Stuart, and Professor Tholuck, Volume 3 by Robert Haldane, Published by EDINBURGH WILLIAM WHYTE & CO, 1842.)

October 30, 2010

Caryl Matrisciana trashes Reformed theology and Lutherans (UPDATED

UPDATE: Now, I just wanted to add that it just occurred to me that Caryl Matrisciana MAY have been into the Rushdoonyite Reconstructionist sort of Calvinism that I've been running into on facebook lately. If so, then I would tend to agree with her on many of her points.

Her site also appears to be down for maintenance so you won't get to read her anti calvinist materials until that's done.


Originally published 1/27/10 8:21 PM

I was just made aware of this the other day.

I have skimmed over Brenda's testimony and jotted down some comments, as well as given a rather cursory glance at the 300 page (!) refutation of Calvinism by Caryl herself. She has effectively thrown much of the discernment community under the bus.

The most obvious problem is Caryl's assertion that Calvinism is something of a 'mind control' cult.

The more I read the more astounded I was at her complete lack of understanding of theology and Scripture regarding grace, sin, a Biblical anthropology, and sanctification. These are MAJOR ISSUES that deeply affect soteriology and the gospel itself.

I will try to go through it more carefully as I have time, but I don't know how long that will be. For now, there it is for you to check out for yourself.

James Sundquist rebuke to Desiring God participants regarding Rick Warren

James Sundquist has published his rebuke to John Piper and his Desiring God participants for at best remaining silent while Rick Warren preached false doctrine from Bethlehem Baptist's pulpit.

A Public Rebuke of Rick Warren, John Piper, Burk Parsons, and Kevin DeYoung

I have to say he is right on on this, I especially appreciated his noting the manipulative way that Warren starts off the speech:

Rick Warren opens his speech by telling us that his having to take care of the sick and his family medical emergencies was a major attack of Satan against him personally. Certainly all Christians have compassion for anyone who goes through difficult circumstances in life, and we know that some of these circumstances are attributable to attacks from Satan. But Rick Warren seems to talk about this in a way that is emotionally manipulative to the audience. How he describes what he is experiencing is rather startling because visiting the sick is something every pastor would be doing in the normal course of being a pastor, as should every Christian. What Rick Warren described would have been typical for a physician who attends patients for any week out of the year. For him to come up and tell the listeners that even administering medical attention to accident victims or someone who came in to the emergency room of the hospital…often in the middle of the night, was another “attack from the enemy…or Satan” would be unthinkable if not bizarre. This should be standard fare for physicians and pastors and the normal response of good Samaritans and conforms to Christ’s command.
I had this in the back of my mind, but had not said it quite as specifically as James did there. I seem to recall Chris Rosebrough also mentioned something about this (note: I am not sure where I heard it...I just remember hearing it from somewhere and the only others who have publicly said anything are James White on No Compromise Radio, Chris Rosebrough on Fighting for the Faith, and Todd Friel on Wretched Radio. No word from the observers of the monkey cage, Doug Wilson, nor Phil Johnson (Part 1) (part 2) yet as far as I know, who had plenty to say in April about how everyone was too upset about this and "let's wait and see" sort of attitude.)

Well we waited and we saw and it was absolutely as horrific as we thought. I guess especially these two don't see this sort of man centered works-righteousness trash as too bothersome then. Nor do they worry if their respected colleagues see it that way. But don't you lay people make snide comments about these colleagues of theirs or you will be referred to as mean spirited, disrespectful, irrational females, or just plain old monkey doo.

I also note especially James's good observations in the final paragraphs. He refers to two pastors who have 'fallen' this past month. I had said something similar when I said I would rather see a good pastor stumble in sin and be corrected by his loving church, than apostasize. No one seems to want to draw any attention to apostasy these days, lest they be labeled divisive. Now we hear Piper, Mohler, Sproul, Macarthur, Phil Johnson, etc give lip service to the idea that we should stand up for truth even if we are labeled divisive. At the moment they are needed these men are silent, and us stay at home moms and such are the ones taking the darts for them. I say, is this what our Christian male leaders have become? Men who hide behind skirts and lay people who are disgusted with this sort of friendship making and networking?

I am reminded of some lines from one of my favorite movies:
Le Bret: Why go about making enemies?
Cyrano: Watching other people making friends, everywhere, as a dog makes friends... I mark the manner of these canine courtesies, and think, Here comes, thank heaven, another enemy!
And the wonderful but oft-misattributed battle quote that many have said is from Martin Luther (but isn't)
“If I profess, with the loudest voice and the clearest exposition, every portion of the truth of God except precisely that little point which the world and the devil are at that moment attacking, I am not confessing Christ, however boldly I may be professing Christianity. Where the battle rages the loyalty of the soldier is proved; and to be steady on all the battle-field besides is mere flight and disgrace to him if he flinches at that one point.”
Never mind flinching, how about the squad leaders sitting home in the barracks or the mess hall having coffee together and discussing their next conference while their men and women are out there getting shelled? Meh, whatever. No biggie I guess. Enough people will still look up to them as honorable upstanding courageous men to keep the money flowing in.

There are also links at the end of James's articles on the problems with Lausanne, where Piper is headed next. I keep meaning to write up something on Lausanne, and Acts 29, but haven't gotten around to it. And this week I've been fighting off the dominionist Rushdoonyite legalists on facebook, which I find very tedious.

I gotta get out and kill a deer, take my mind off the craziness. If only the deer would cooperate.

"Cursed be any love or unity for whose sake the Word of God must be put at stake." -- Martin Luther

October 28, 2010

Pray for Bob DeWaay

Twin City Fellowship has posted the sad news about Bob DeWaay's health on their front page now. (On the left underneath Faith At Risk being cancelled)

Please keep them all in prayer for restoration, repentance, and healing in this devastating situation. We love the DeWaay's very much and have been blessed so greatly by his teaching.

Drinking is not a sin in itself, but drunkenness (and I would suggest addiction, whether or not you feel drunk or high) is. The line is often very blurry between these two and many people find themselves entangled without knowing what to do.

May the Lord guide the elders at Twin City Fellowship, and the DeWaays, as they go forward. You are all in our prayers.

October 19, 2010

Issues Etc review of Rick Warren's "Blessed or Stressed" sermon

Issues Etc put together a brutal montage of statements from a recent sermon by Rick Warren entitled "Blessed or Stressed"? It's something like I was thinking of doing with his speech at Desiring God. They play all the clips of what we must DO to get God's blessing, back to back.

Issues Etc's RIck Warren Quid Pro Quo God soundbite (only 1 minute 22 seconds)

This illustrates the point very well. Do this Do that Do this do that DO MORE... You need to do X so that God can do Y. God is somehow limited by your actions and attitudes? That sounds word-faithy to me... This is not a concept taught in Scripture, than God is limited by our sin and/or enabled by our good works. This false idea taught by Rick Warren and more blatantly by the TBN crowd, is frankly blasphemous. It puts Man in charge, not God.

The sermon that they reviewed is here:

Another one...

This content has been moved.

Please Pray for Bob DeWaay - health concerns

Without going into detail, I would like to ask that people please pray for Bob DeWaay and his family. He is having some serious health issues and exhaustion is a major problem for him right now along with other debilitating symptoms. Many of you know he has severe asthma and they are trying to manage it, but it seems to have been very bad this past year for him and doctors and the people around him are very concerned for his health.

We love you Bob, and pray that our sovereign Lord, who rises up with healing in his wings, will give you healing if it be his will, and the grace and strength to carry on and be a blessing to us for many more years!

October 13, 2010

Rick Warren lies and is unrepentant

Well if Ergun can, i guess then it's ok, right?

We see that one of the people to whom Rick Attributed his "pirates" tweet has responded. It does seem that DespisingMin was not involved in coming up with that tweet but defends it as humorous and that the song describes Chris Rosebrough well. Still have yet to hear from the blasphemous and vulgar ApprisingMin (who is not Ken Silva, but a person trying to mock Ken Silva).

I thought Rick Warren told us it's best to ignore "attacks" and not "stoop to their level?" You know, every time he attacks his critics they just get more followers...

October 12, 2010

Ergun Caner at Value Voter Summit 2010

Can you believe this guy?

Ergun Caner - Value Voter Summit Sept 17 2010

10 minutes in, after having talked about what a nitwit he is compared to all these other people here. This becomes a defense mechanism against criticism, similar to what we saw with Francis Chan at Desiring God this year. (He starts with it right off the bat, talking like some sort of groupie.)

Caner: "We would rather lose and do the right thing than win and compromise truth. Doing that which is expedient is not NEARLY as important as doing that which is right befor the eyes of God. I would rather stand for the marriage between a man and a woman than to compromise and have to face my God some day."

So to him homosexuality is REALLY bad and God will judge that, but lying well, that's ok. Since when is lying and attacking brothers and sisters in Christ who are calling for you to repent a family value? He keeps talking about worrying about what he's teaching his kids about living according to God's standards. Is this the sort of men he wants his kids to become?

"am I ever going to be in their eyes what I should be?"

Ergun Caner 2010 Values Voter Summit pt.2

leading up to 3 minutes in, he talks about people that criticize and not letting them get to you. Thankfully he refrains from tying it to the developments with his lying testimony. He does say he lost his family, father, home, culture. Still not sure how he lost his home. He didn't lose his home. His dad was already out of it, his mom didn't disown him. That doesn't seem to jive with the facts. Still unrepentant after all this time.

"When the whole world turns against you you smile, you love em, and you never let em shut you up." -- Ergun Caner

Uhuh. Yeah. Right.

Ergun Caner's Greatest Fear

Back in late August of 08, Ergun Caner started a sermon series called "Diary of a Slacker." The date of the Liberty U Campus Church podcast where he introduced the series was August 27. I haven't listened to much of him since he was dismissed, but since i'm caught up on all the other stuff I usually listen to, I decided to start this one.

I grabbed an excerpt of it from about 20 minutes in or so.

Caner spends a few min talking to his son after having talked about himself and making crude offensive jokes for much of the first 20 minutes. (Warning there are a few in this clip too.) Then he brings is son Braxton out... (spontaneously? Like he would be right there waiting, if it was spontaneous?)

Notice how he's taught his son to be the same way as himself, albeit not nearly as polished and believable. The kid seems to be repeating lines he was told to say. It doesn't seem to be very spontaneous for him. And Caner is laughing at him hysterically as if he's never heard the lines before. Now maybe he hadn't, but I'm convinced someone told that kid what kind of obnoxious, push-the-envelope crude things to say. Braxton ends the interview with a last word to the crowd. "If there's any hotties, call me!" Ergun thinks that's great and makes a joke about getting fired.

Yes ha ha that is all so funny (not really). But then his tone changes. He addresses the topic he is going to introduce, and he talks about his greatest fear. In light of all that's happened, this segment is so tragic. It seems, when you consider his reaction to having been exposed, that he really is terrified of acknowledging the truth, because it's going to bring about his greatest fear.

However, the failure in God's eyes would have occurred at the first fabrication. That failure he doesn't seem to fear nearly as much as the public failure. Despite his public protestations indicating he is an equal opportunity offender of people, this kind of behavior shows us that his priority lies with man and not with God. Tragic.

Theology has consequences. Grace, if he really believes in it, would understand that if he truly belongs to the Lord, even these sins are forgiven and he need not fear being honest about them.

October 8, 2010

Rick Warren takes public swipe at his critics and NAMES NAMES

Rick Warren has shown his true colors this morning, taking a swipe at Ken Silva, Ingrid Schlueter, and Chris Rosebrough all in one fell tweet (retweeted supposedly from one of his supporters, who uses the fake "ApprisingMin") Apprising Min is a moniker that is used to try and mock and discredit Ken Silva. This is much like when Richard Abanes, former music ministry member at Saddleback, and un-official ankle biter for Rick, created a parody site for Ingrid's Slice of Laodicea blog, calling it Slice of Laodicea Church. He even made it look almost exactly like hers. Don't any of these people have an original idea?


Rick has protected his tweets but if you go to his main page you can scroll back and find it, at least until he becomes embarrassed enough to delete it. The time stamp is approximately 10-7-2010 about 3:30pm give or take. (estimating from the '19 hours ago' that currently shows on the twitter feed as I write this).

Even I must admit, attacking those who would call you to repentance in 140 characters or less takes some talent and creativity and innovation. But Rick tops them all by managing to attack THREE of his critics at once within the Twitter parameters! I think that must deserve a trophy of some sort to put in his umpty thousand book library. Since he is so keen on mentioning all his good works in every public appearance (his tithing is now up to 91 percent, I'll have you know!), I figure that's about the only prize he's going to get per Matthew 6:1-4.

“Beware of practicing your righteousness before other people in order to be seen by them, for then you will have no reward from your Father who is in heaven.

“Thus, when you give to the needy, sound no trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may be praised by others. Truly, I say to you, they have received their reward. But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you.

Hmm... that reminds me also of this tweet:

But I digress.

Back to the point about Pirates who don't do anythng, Chris Rosebrough had an excellent response:
Here's the theme verse for the "Do Nothing Pirates" Romans 4:4-8...come join the crew!! Thx @RickWarren

It's also been discovered that Rick's Re-tweet of the snide comment against Ingrid, Ken, and Chris was not actually a re-tweet at all. No tweets on the ApprisingMin or DespisingMin feed actually say what Rick seems to be attributing to them. Perhaps he thinks RT means "reply tweet" (but generally if someone is replying to a specific tweet, they use the reply link and it will show up as "in reply to (whoever)" and then you can click on that link to see what the tweet was.

Perhaps they deleted the original that had been re-tweeted. But if so, then the re-tweet by Rick would also disappear. Unless he copied and pasted it into a new tweet of its own. Regardless of how the tweet originated, those words went out under the authority of Rick Warren himself, whether or not he has minions posting his pithy little catch phrases for him. (Maybe one of these days when he tweets something egotistical or foolish he'll get really clever and claim his account has been hacked!)

Right after posting the Pirates-who-don't-do-anything tweet, Rick posted this:
"Don't be bluffed into silence or insincerity by the threats of religious bullies...There's nothing they can do to your soul" Lk12:4 (Mes)(Screenshot)
(Original source)
Oh you mean bullies... like those who spend quite a bit of time and energy threatening legal action against and bullying their critics? And "pastor's" sycophants who stalk and harass and try to impersonate and steal the identity of the pastor's critics? Those kinds of bullies Rick?

He also seems to be answering those who have been upset with Desiring God for inviting him and their endorsement of his 50 minutes of expounding man's traditions and a little dash of God's law on Friday night last:
Guilt by association is the childish tactic of those with feeble minds & arguments.If u smell it know their logic is bogus.

How about guilt by endorsement and promotion, Rick? Way to sock it to that straw man, Mr. Spock.

Incidentally there have been a couple other general swipes at his critics the last few days:
Some people only feel close to God when they're angry & attacking.It's caused by fear & deep disappointment. Just love them
original source
"Fools are quick to announce when they are upset.The wise IGNORE insults." Proverbs12:16
original source

HMMMMM..... I guess it doesn't really pay to speculate, but it's sure tempting as to why he isn't INGORING these perceived insults.

Let a righteous man strike me—it is a kindness;
let him rebuke me—it is oil for my head;
let my head not refuse it. --Psalm 141:5a ESV

At the very least, I pray something of the truth is finally getting through to him and cracking that self righteous facade.

Psst... Rick! Don't believe everything that you think! The Bible says that we can't be trusted to tell ourselves the truth!
(source 11:00-11:14)

(edit for new info)

More commentary at Airo, including quite a few good links, some of which I have posted previously: Rick Warren responds To His Critics

Ken has put up his post on this just now also: Apprising Ministries, Rick Warren, & Twitter